Hi all
I am a CMS newbie. So please be patient and pardon me if my questions seem dumb.
I am planning to set up a website (in Persian) where users will be able to post their stories along with images (a multi user blog?), share their photos and comment (and possibly vote) on each other's stories/posts. The full support for Persian capability is a deciding factor in my case for obvious reasons.
So far, my impression of s9y has been a really positive one; I managed to do a test on my server with complete ease and change the language to Persian in a breeze.
My questions:
1- My site needs to "look" like a normal website with blogging as "one of" its core features, (say something like this for example: http://www.igougo.com/ ) rather than a site with a typical "blog look" with added features. I've found only one site that looks more like a website than a blog so far: http://www.vindonhealthcare.com/
I do appreciate this is not what s9y has been designed for, but I've fallen in love with its simplicity and can even accept a few small compromises. Is it very difficult to archive this look?
2- It's very important which route I take; I am confused if I need to install Mambo/Joomla as CMS at all? I am a firm believer in simple and lean solutions (kudos s9y) and if Serendipity gives me what I need, then I will be able to bypass Mambo and rely on s9y as CMS. In other words, will s9y+plugins be able to do what Mambo does (for what I need)?
3- As I understand s9y creates static html pages instead of dynamic. Isn't it limiting for what I want to do? Will I be able to insert scripts like Google Earth mashups, travel search engines etc on the front page?
I am sorry for my long winded post. Please help.
Minstrel
s9y as CMS?
Re: s9y as CMS?
I'm not sure whether you're gonna have to go with a multi-blog/shared installation here, maybe enabling users to register and post in one blog would be suitable. Depends on the actual site you have in mind - should every user have their own blog or should it be one blog with multiple users?Minstrel wrote:I am planning to set up a website (in Persian) where users will be able to post their stories along with images (a multi user blog?), share their photos and comment (and possibly vote) on each other's stories/posts.
Well, that really depends on the template. There are some s9y templates which do look more like a cms than a blog already, i.e. Mimbo.Minstrel wrote:1- My site needs to "look" like a normal website with blogging as "one of" its core features, rather than a site with a typical "blog look" with added features.
Considering what you have in mind, you're most definitely going to want/need a custom template. Actually, you're going to have to do a lot of customization altogether.
Well, what's difficult?Minstrel wrote:Is it very difficult to archive this look?
If you're new to s9y, templates and Smarty, this is probably going to be difficult since I figure it's going to require some very advanced template stuff. But maybe not, it all really depends on what you really want to do.We're probably going to need some more input on what exactly it is you need. Can you specify some must-have features?Minstrel wrote:In other words, will s9y+plugins be able to do what Mambo does (for what I need)?
I don't think so. You're going to use static pages for the stuff which actually is static (i.e. "changes almost never"), like an imprint, and dynamic pages (blog entries etc.) for the rest.Minstrel wrote:3- As I understand s9y creates static html pages instead of dynamic. Isn't it limiting for what I want to do?
Probably yes. Depends a little on how those things are implemented as far as I can see. Inserting javascript stuff, for example, is not a problem at all.Minstrel wrote:Will I be able to insert scripts like Google Earth mashups, travel search engines etc on the front page?
YL
Hi yellowled
Thank you for quick response.
I don't need every user to have their own blog. I'm after a single page multi-user blog and not a multi-blog site. This takes me to another simple but big question: Can this entries be screened (for quality, use of appropriate language, etc) before they are published? I assume I should have that option?
The Mimbo template looks fantastic. I think it will get my job done, in terms of style and function. Is it compatible with RTL languages?
Here's a summary of the essentials for the site:
1- A (single) diary, where people can comment, hopefully with archiving ability -- if yes, then a wild question; can these be sorted based on popularity, tags etc?
2- A forum (which should be a non-issue through a link)
3- A front page with the ability to embed Java scripts, selected features linked to other pages (just like Mimbo, i guess). Pardon my ignorance but will this Mimbo front page be static or dynamic? And would it make any difference?
4- A gallery where users can post photos (and ideally with search options)
So basically a community site with users providing the material, i guess UGC is the right term. s9y can achieve these purposes, I assume?
Thanks again
Minstrel
Thank you for quick response.
I don't need every user to have their own blog. I'm after a single page multi-user blog and not a multi-blog site. This takes me to another simple but big question: Can this entries be screened (for quality, use of appropriate language, etc) before they are published? I assume I should have that option?
The Mimbo template looks fantastic. I think it will get my job done, in terms of style and function. Is it compatible with RTL languages?
Here's a summary of the essentials for the site:
1- A (single) diary, where people can comment, hopefully with archiving ability -- if yes, then a wild question; can these be sorted based on popularity, tags etc?
2- A forum (which should be a non-issue through a link)
3- A front page with the ability to embed Java scripts, selected features linked to other pages (just like Mimbo, i guess). Pardon my ignorance but will this Mimbo front page be static or dynamic? And would it make any difference?
4- A gallery where users can post photos (and ideally with search options)
So basically a community site with users providing the material, i guess UGC is the right term. s9y can achieve these purposes, I assume?
Thanks again
Minstrel
Minstrel,
S9Y can be a dynamic part of that solution.
I don't know about the RTL langauge support in Mimbo; I'll let its designer speak to that point.
1) S9Y is a single-user blog -- a diary, as you say -- with support for multiple authors. The entries can be sorted by author, category or date. The template can even change for each category. Nothing is ever discarded, unless you specifically delete it, so each entry is archived. In the standard configuration, there is no way to sort based on popularity or tags. However, the tag plugin does allow viewing all entries with an appropriate tag, and there is a "most popular" plugin (although it probably needs some work) which interacts with a Karma plugin, providing an entry rating system to your users. Note that s9y can be configured so that entries must be approved before they are displayed.
2) There is a forum plugin, although it is rudimentary. Providing a link to a forum is a popular alternative. The only concern with a separate forum is synchronization: users don't automatically get a forum account unless you do some custom programming, and you'll want to make a template for the forum that looks like the s9y template. These are not issues with the forum plugin, but you give up some functionality.
3) The Smarty templating system controls the blog appearance, so modifying the front page to include HTML, Javascript, applets, or other functionality is a trivial matter of modifying the main template file. In general, the front page is a banner, sidebars, and a list of recent entries, all of which are dynamically generated from the s9y database. You can add static elements in the template file simply by entering their HTML in the appropriate location within the template file. Additionally, both Javascript and HTML can be added to selected locations on the page or the sidebars without any file editing: simply install one or more HTML Nugget plugins to hold the content and edit them in the administration panel.
4) Although s9y has a media manager, it isn't configured as a gallery. There are plugins to add this functionality; you'll have to evaluate them on your own. A separate gallery program, such as Gallery2, could be used; it would have the same synchronization concerns as the separate forum.
I hope I could help you find some answers. I recommend installing s9y on a separate site, perhaps a subdomain, and experimenting to determine whether the plugins will provide the capabilities you desire.
S9Y can be a dynamic part of that solution.
I don't know about the RTL langauge support in Mimbo; I'll let its designer speak to that point.
1) S9Y is a single-user blog -- a diary, as you say -- with support for multiple authors. The entries can be sorted by author, category or date. The template can even change for each category. Nothing is ever discarded, unless you specifically delete it, so each entry is archived. In the standard configuration, there is no way to sort based on popularity or tags. However, the tag plugin does allow viewing all entries with an appropriate tag, and there is a "most popular" plugin (although it probably needs some work) which interacts with a Karma plugin, providing an entry rating system to your users. Note that s9y can be configured so that entries must be approved before they are displayed.
2) There is a forum plugin, although it is rudimentary. Providing a link to a forum is a popular alternative. The only concern with a separate forum is synchronization: users don't automatically get a forum account unless you do some custom programming, and you'll want to make a template for the forum that looks like the s9y template. These are not issues with the forum plugin, but you give up some functionality.
3) The Smarty templating system controls the blog appearance, so modifying the front page to include HTML, Javascript, applets, or other functionality is a trivial matter of modifying the main template file. In general, the front page is a banner, sidebars, and a list of recent entries, all of which are dynamically generated from the s9y database. You can add static elements in the template file simply by entering their HTML in the appropriate location within the template file. Additionally, both Javascript and HTML can be added to selected locations on the page or the sidebars without any file editing: simply install one or more HTML Nugget plugins to hold the content and edit them in the administration panel.
4) Although s9y has a media manager, it isn't configured as a gallery. There are plugins to add this functionality; you'll have to evaluate them on your own. A separate gallery program, such as Gallery2, could be used; it would have the same synchronization concerns as the separate forum.
I hope I could help you find some answers. I recommend installing s9y on a separate site, perhaps a subdomain, and experimenting to determine whether the plugins will provide the capabilities you desire.
Well, I don't think we'll be able to get him in herejudebert wrote:I don't know about the RTL langauge support in Mimbo; I'll let its designer speak to that point.
(Mimbo is a Wordpress port.)I, being the porting monkey in this case, have never checked RTL support in Mimbo. All I can really do in that case would be switching the language direction in Firefox, and I'm not sure that proves anything.
Maybe someone using a RTL language can help out here?
YL
Many thanks judebert
The idea of having a forum plugin came as a pleasant surprise. I was considering SMF as my forum. A synchronized forum would be an ideal feature for the site. I'm definitely ready to accept a few compromises in terms of functions as long as it runs smoothly in RTL.
yellowled
I think I won't know before I try. Right now I'm uploading the installation files. I'll try soon and see if Mimbo supports RTL.
As judebert put it, I think I'm at a stage now where I need to fiddle around with plugins to make them fit my needs. The plugin repository seem comprehensive.
I guess the most important thing in choosing a system/cms is support and informative opinions, which I'm getting plenty of, quickly. This alone is enough for me to take the plunge, not to mention simplicity as well as solid security of s9y that people rave about.
Thank you both
Minstrel
The idea of having a forum plugin came as a pleasant surprise. I was considering SMF as my forum. A synchronized forum would be an ideal feature for the site. I'm definitely ready to accept a few compromises in terms of functions as long as it runs smoothly in RTL.
yellowled
I think I won't know before I try. Right now I'm uploading the installation files. I'll try soon and see if Mimbo supports RTL.
As judebert put it, I think I'm at a stage now where I need to fiddle around with plugins to make them fit my needs. The plugin repository seem comprehensive.
I guess the most important thing in choosing a system/cms is support and informative opinions, which I'm getting plenty of, quickly. This alone is enough for me to take the plunge, not to mention simplicity as well as solid security of s9y that people rave about.
Thank you both
Minstrel
Hi Minstrel
With all the information Yellowled and Judebert have given you you've probably got the idea now, serendipity will pretty much do whatever you want with a bit of tweaking here and there.
I designed the Vindon healthcare site and probably have another 30 or so commercial sites based on serendipity online and I've always based my sites on dynamic rather than static pages but I know other designers prefer to go the static page route. They both have their virtues.
Whichever way you go, if you need any help I'll be happy to pitch in too.
Dave
With all the information Yellowled and Judebert have given you you've probably got the idea now, serendipity will pretty much do whatever you want with a bit of tweaking here and there.
I designed the Vindon healthcare site and probably have another 30 or so commercial sites based on serendipity online and I've always based my sites on dynamic rather than static pages but I know other designers prefer to go the static page route. They both have their virtues.
Whichever way you go, if you need any help I'll be happy to pitch in too.
Dave
Hi Dave
Thanks for all the info. How can I get a completely blank page in sy9?
Well, the RTL aligning side of things appears to be more of a challenge than I thought. I've tried nearly every template and noticed that only "RTL-Languages v0.4" can work in RTL, but even then not without problems; some of plugin titles render into unreadable characters. Same thing happens to page tiles as well, when I rename the titles into Persian.
Maybe I'm pushing the wrong buttons, or am I asking too much of customization? Please help.
Minstrel
Thanks for all the info. How can I get a completely blank page in sy9?
Well, the RTL aligning side of things appears to be more of a challenge than I thought. I've tried nearly every template and noticed that only "RTL-Languages v0.4" can work in RTL, but even then not without problems; some of plugin titles render into unreadable characters. Same thing happens to page tiles as well, when I rename the titles into Persian.
Maybe I'm pushing the wrong buttons, or am I asking too much of customization? Please help.
Minstrel
Usually a completely blank page is a server error; sometimes an .htaccess misconfiguration, sometimes a PHP memory problem... if you're getting a blank page unexpectedly, the server error logs should tell you what happened.
If you want a blank page, you'll have to modify your index.tpl. Serendipity naturally provides sidebars, banner, and entries as content; to get rid of them, you need to remove all that stuff from the index.tpl. I can't imagine why you'd want that, though.
Perhaps you want a page with no formatting, just plain HTML? In that case, edit the index.tpl and comment out the line that includes the Serendipity CSS file.
On the big problem: unreadable characters usually occur when the Serendipity setting for language encoding (usually UTF-8) and the database encoding differ. Make sure they match. This won't fix old data, but all the new data should be correct.
We've had a few people with Arabic languages -- which I believe are RTL -- so I think Persian should be achievable. If you let us know specifically what's wrong, we'll try to help you out. In particular, we need to know what you did, what you expected, and what you actually got.
If you want a blank page, you'll have to modify your index.tpl. Serendipity naturally provides sidebars, banner, and entries as content; to get rid of them, you need to remove all that stuff from the index.tpl. I can't imagine why you'd want that, though.
Perhaps you want a page with no formatting, just plain HTML? In that case, edit the index.tpl and comment out the line that includes the Serendipity CSS file.
On the big problem: unreadable characters usually occur when the Serendipity setting for language encoding (usually UTF-8) and the database encoding differ. Make sure they match. This won't fix old data, but all the new data should be correct.
We've had a few people with Arabic languages -- which I believe are RTL -- so I think Persian should be achievable. If you let us know specifically what's wrong, we'll try to help you out. In particular, we need to know what you did, what you expected, and what you actually got.